And he created a victim-centered narrative. But it becomes a very powerful selling and marketing point. It suggests that at the heart of this, you know, venerable, lauded, beloved, you know, spiritual/wellness practice, theres this really dark problem that, that hasnt been looked at and hasnt, and hasnt been addressed. Yeah. Every morning that I was there in Mysore, I saw three other women who, who got assaulted in those three postures. Previously, I was a postdoctoral fellow in the Laboratoire Jacques-Louis LionsLink opens in a new window at Sorbonne Universit with Prof Ugo BoscainLink opens in a new window and a member of the Inria ParisLink opens in a new window team CAGELink opens in a new window. 8 Critical Problems in Modern Yoga, and How to Work with Them, Hes probably BKS Iyengars most famous, most prominent, most senior student, and the one who most embodies his own teaching persona, Michael Roach of the Asian Classics Institute, solo truth and reconciliation tear on his blog, The Embodiment Conference and Beyond: A Trauma-Aware Call to Healing [Guest Post], Trump Eating Poison is a Sacrament of Charismatic Escalation, During COVID-19, Charles Eisenstein Invites You to Think Deeply About His Awesome Writing. And thats it, right? Look up Karen Rain's phone number, home address, email address, and other personal information. There is also, as you mentioned, a scope of practice for the yoga humanities that I think would be a good idea. Like what, what responsibility are we actually talking about and can that discussion survive the fact that one of the reasons that Karen Rain was assaulted over and over again was because the group had deceived her about what was going on? Required fields are marked *. I dont think we have a clear idea of what the commitments, the social and economic and relational commitments, there are or were or were supposed to have existed between teachers and students that might ground all of this stuff. I hate that phrase, but I think theres theres nothing to have been done about it. If you dont take responsibility for your body, you will end up in a wheelchair! There was somehow an implied knowledge of that but nobody spoke out. As Im listening to you, Im imagining the listener that may not be familiar with the Mysore style of practice. 1:47:51. Most recently youve written a book about problematic group dynamics in the yoga world and its called Practice and All is Coming: Abuse, Cult Dynamics and Healing in Yoga, and Beyond. Hes probably BKS Iyengars most famous, most prominent, most senior student, and the one who most embodies his own teaching persona. The whole story was hidden in plain sight. This is hardcore. Or are you giving people the impression that you know, what yoga philosophy says when actually very few people know what or understand the depth and breadth of yoga philosophy? Um, and Ive taken a few classes here or there. People asked for like a decade. In my lack of action, I made myself complicit. Karen Haberman 1958 Karen Haberman, born Circa 1958. And so I think its very confusing. Love and respect! Each of the three Sanskrit words, sat, chit, and ananda, all speak of different aspects of . mike vernon royal household; are there snakes in gran canaria; shooting in laurel, md yesterday. I studied Asthanga yoga for 10 years in the 90s but somehow avoided going to Mysore. Yes. I proved that I think in my book by citing the work of several historians of medieval yoga, or one in particular, Dr Jason Birch, who says theres no evidence for anybody physically assisting anybody else in a yoga posture prior to the 20th century. The further problem with assigning responsibility, regardless of what that even means like what does that mean? Why shouldnt their sexuality somehow be included in that? Great questions. So, you know, those are individual choices for sure. Karen lived in 1974, at address, Wisconsin. In 1993, she was one of . I lay in bed for a long time and reflected, a process that continued through the night and in half daze this morning when reading the rest. We know that Karen M. (Haberman) Golson had been residing in Texas . I think Matthews book has gone beyond the final draft state but he may still record further cases if you are interested. Please dont feel bad thinking that you could have or should have done something differently. Is it about the clothing? It happens to people who arent educated at all. Notify me of follow-up comments by email. I think she is a scatterbrain. What does Karen Rain have to say? Marian was a Charter. Right. I will address you, Karen, now directly and will get Matthew to forward you my response. I do know that whether theyre accurate interpretations or not, there are all kinds of yoga or Buddhist or pseudo-yoga or pseudo-Buddhist ideas around, emptiness, interpretability, the play of Lila, karma, all kinds of, of terms that are correctly or incorrectly used to describe or to rationalize things that we would rather not confront as being abusive. They shouldnt because it sounds like a really good thing. I feel like I know her a lot better than I know him, but I still wouldnt presume to know why she makes choices that she does. 9:53. How much of that have men done to women through the ages. Theyre working together. But this feeling that people are getting individual attention and that when the teacher comes around and pays them that close attention. Karen has been found in 12 states including Wisconsin, Alabama, Oregon, California, Colorado. Gregor. Atascadero - 22.85 inches to date - average 12 . The Debates in Post-Development and Degrowth Journal, published by Tvergastein, is an academic journal dealing with debates and works focused on advancing postdevelopment & degrowth thought. Theres always something mysterious or like, or a little bit beyond or childlike or innocent or super spiritual about the leader, about Mr. Jois or about Manouso Manos. Shiva Details: Visitors are welcome to return to the residence Sunday after the conclusion of the burial at the cemetery, and visitation will continue from 7:00 p.m. to 9:00 p.m. Shiva visits Monday and Tuesday from 2:00 p.m. to 4:00 p.m. and 7:00 p.m. to 9:00 p.m. Evening services will be held daily at 7:00 p.m. And the cover-up is still going on. And apparently he would stop from time to time, but like somebody who had clearly an illness, he wasnt able to stop for very long. I didnt initially. What the public is less aware of is that its fairly easy for your run of the mill yoga teacher to manipulate a whole class of people intellectually and then psychologically by claiming that they know more about yoga philosophy than they actually do. And theres been a lot of divided opinion about the value of what I do ever since then. The book that started to emerge out of that research project was originally called Shadow Pose, and the project name was What Are We Actually Doing in Asana? The reason why Im writing this is because there is still an emperor with no clothes in Mysuru. Its an invention. Algorithms & Computationally Intensive Inference seminars. I talked to her about the process of projection, about idealizing a person, about giving up ones power, hypnotizing oneself into beliefs and finally about taking self-responsibility. Not that he really gave a protocol: he assaulted people. He would burst into tears at one point. If youve been to a Vinyasa class, you are probably benefiting from Joiss legacy if youve been in a class where rhythmic breathing has been timed with movement in some sort of coordinated way thats all coming from Jois. A book is a different thing, you know, when its editorialized and fact checked and theres legal backing of publication behind it, its 380 pages long and theres 380 foot notes or whatever, its well-cooked. How do the spiritual metaphysics factor in to this cocktail of toxic group dynamic? But anyway, their list of the things that you can do is all laid out for you. So I want to dive into that. Or about Bikram Choudhury, although less so, more and more people would see him clearly for who he is. And so the assaults actually took place in plain view of everybody, but under the auspices or under this this story that he was adjusting people, that he was helping students attain postures that they couldnt otherwise attain or even more kind of deceptively, and I would say creepily, that his touch was conveying some kind of spiritual knowledge. This has to stop. He goes on to further his studies, later on in his life with Mr. Krishnamacharya and assumed a teaching position at the Mysore Yoga Shala sometime in the late Thirties. And so from this one gym which was set up by the Maharaja Wodiyar in 1934, we have two of the pillars of the modern yoga evangelical movement. Thats moving kind of slowly because I think theres a lot of fear around the control that the family still has over the finances and the copyrights and the ability to practice, uh, or to teach the, the, the method, quote-unquote legally or with the validation of the family. He had been trained in the Mysore Yoga Shala at a very crucial point in the development of modern yoga history. Now thats new. Karen, you have brilliantly explored the issue of complicity in your interview, so I need not embark here on the issue. And so Ill talk about her in the second section as well, in the second part of this answer, and she was assaulted repeatedly, but she said, you know, this happened to me in three different postures every single morning. How much time is actually occupied? We have 24 records for Karen Haberman ranging in age from 39 years old to 79 years old. '', '' ..? www.matthewremski.com/wordpress/karen-rain-speaks-about-pattabhi-jois-and-recovering-from-sexual-and-spiritual-abuse-video-interview/. Karen Rain, formerly Haberman, was one of six students in a very early-days video of Pattabhi Jois directing them through the Primary series, that I had watched repeatedly on mute. And I found it very weird for a so-called therapeutic practice that people came to for spiritual benefit, but they also seem to be working themselves really hard in. Karen Rain (Haberman), Richard Freeman, Tim Miller, Pattabhi Jois, Chuck Miller, Eddie Stern, Maty Ezraty. There was like five likes to it. Thats what they said. Karen #MeToo ( . So it just is what it is. Authorized teachers. Theres also 16 women who said He assaulted me, and this is how he did it. One is enough. I mean, objectification is just dehumanizing. Still I was both sexually assaulted and violently adjusted by Jois on his visits to the States, as I detailed in Matthews article. The network of complicity. And this is what happened to us and this is how we feel about what will create safety and respect, not only for us, but for students going forward. The only phone number that . And it had started with the strange realization that everybody that I knew who had professionalized into the yoga world or who was a really dedicated student was injured in some way. Maggie Lindsy Haberman (born October 30, 1973) is an American journalist, a White House correspondent for The New York Times, and a political analyst for CNN.She previously worked as a political reporter for the New York Post, the New York Daily News, and Politico.She wrote about Donald Trump for those publications and rose to prominence covering his campaign, presidency, and post-presidency . Loving mother and mother-in-law of Michael Whitla and the late Lisa Haberman, the late Jennifer Haberman, and the late Becca Haberman. I think its really kind of awful serendipity really because it was reportable. Karen Rain is a writer, tutor and nature lover. Where did she disappear to?" She got so far away from the Ashtanga scene in the yoga world in general, she changed her name and it's like nobody wanted to ask a little bit further? via Matthew Remski On November 11th, Karen Rain, formerly known as Karen Haberman, posted the following #metoo disclosure about her studies with Pattabhi Jois, creator of "Ashtanga Yoga": For eight years, Rain was in the top echelon of Jois' most accomplished students. Thats a really crucial moment actually because one of the things that comes up in each one of these yoga or Buddhist community, you know, spiritual, physical, emotional, sexual abuse cases is that the behavior of the actual actions of the leader of the perpetrator are always interpretable. Karen Haberman might be my least favorite teacher of all time. It is a ritual of domination. Karen . In the last 24 hours I have hear from several sides that the video showing KP Jois sexually assaulting and adjusting violently students has been taken down several times by petitions of Jois followers. So its a young group, I think about five, and one of them isnt a teacher, I think her name is Emma. It was the students who said these things about him. So youre basically practicing independently and then the teacher comes around and adjust you or, quote-unquote assists you. And thats a tough place to be in. And then that second layer of isolation leads to a kind of internal isolation from your own moral sense, where its like you had values that helped you navigate the world. View Public Record Results &check; Addresses. I hope that we as a movement, the Ashtanga culture, can stop doing that and be truthful about what happened. Right now, Karen Haberman lives in Corvallis, OR. I think thats a really sound principle. I try to lay out a number of tools that I think Im not an expert in this but I think will be helpful as teachers, students and administrators and yoga service providers and yoga academics as well go forward in figuring out how to identify toxic group dynamics. And that it was going to stand in the way of her spiritual development or something like that. And you know, she didnt give the impression in the interview that she totally bought off on the idea then, but she bought off on it enough to be confused and to be disarmed and to be put in this position where she felt that her own critical thinking or her resistance to the idea was somehow problematic. You can update your cookie preferences at any time. And in Yoga at large, I know yoga is kind of like the wild, wild west of, industries. At this point, after having read in the wake of MeToo so many accounts of sexual abuse by women conducted by men, I feel an almost primal shame of being male. When that came up, that was well known as well. What did you actually learn? 35 records for Karen Haberman. For further information, such as about my researchLink opens in a new window and a CVLink opens in a new window, please visit my personal websiteLink opens in a new window. I dont think so. She enjoys dancing, going for walks in the woods with her three cats and playing games with friends. Yoga. Prior to that, I was a Hausdorff Postdoc at the Hausdorff Center for MathematicsLink opens in a new window at the University of Bonn and a member of Prof Karl-Theodor SturmLink opens in a new windows group on Stochastic and Geometric Analysis at the Institute for Applied MathematicsLink opens in a new window. Although its not like the reactions that theyve had to my more informal blog work over the years, which a lot of people have just been able to dismiss or to say its agenda driven or something like that or that, You just hate our community, or something. You are yourself a survivor of two cults, and I know that part of this work in this book has been a bit of a healing journey for you. Why didnt you go to a journalist? In Joiss circumstance it becomes really complicated because one of the things that the Ashtanga world has prided itself on for the last 30 years is the sense that the teacher is able to learn and know about the student intimately because they are having personal interactions with them multiple times per morning, every morning, six mornings per week, two hours per session, two days off per month. Karen is deeply missed by all who loved her. It does hit me on a personal level. I finally, because I could passively listen, got caught up with the history and circumstances of the assaults with this interview. I am concerned that the wool is still being pulled over the eyes of young, unsuspecting people. Karen grew up in Nunn attending elementary, junior high, and high school there, and she graduated in the first class at the newly-formed Highland High School in . So if youre new to all of this jargon, and youve been to a flow class you are benefiting from and perhaps being injured by Joiss legacy. I never really pursued Ashtanga yoga myself. And the Ashtanga/Jois form has spawned into numerous side forms, right? I think an apology should be issued by the Jois family for sexual assault and violating adjustments. I realized then that I was a member of a cult. Right. Hi there, just wanted to mention, I enjoyed this post. And you could meditate your way into believing that there was perhaps, but most people are not actually having that experience and we shouldnt be telling them that they should. Theyre implying that they belong to a heritage rather than a branded family business. For security, use of Google's reCAPTCHA service is required which is subject to the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of Use. SIGN UP; . At that point I decided that I must have hallucinated or made things up or maybe it was my ego or deviant nature that projected my own problems on the guru. They are watching sexual assault taking place like before their own eyes and theyre saying, Oh, we dont know whats happening. 1993. And how did that lead to abuse both physical and sexual under, under him in his classes, and describe what that dynamic looked like. My knees were getting better at the time and I could again do most of my practise. Its more like Indian anti-colonial activists in the 1920s and 1930s wanted to indigenize physical culture influences from Europe. And I believe we are or should I say that we can become that? Lived In Amherst MA, Mill Valley CA. Id even say his own fans arent responsible for him deceiving them! All Rights Reserved. Karen Eastland Master of Letters, BA 2017, MLitt 2019, member of the Golden Key Asia Pacific Honour Society 2020 And at a certain point I realized that the injury question in the Ashtanga world, which is profound, its, it goes deep was still a surface question to the abuse issue that had been silent for many, many years, but also carried by a number of women survivors in a kind of whisper network as well. And I dont think you have to be worried about virtue-signaling by referring to what survivors of sexual assault need. And I know that it works in practice in many circumstances, but it also sets up a very, very vulnerable situation in which, people can be exploited in plain sight. I should have trusted in my intuition and pursued that until it would blow up in some form or another. Its almost as if the portrait will stay on the altar to preserve something that if it cracks will crack the entire world along with it. So even with people that were initially critical, theyve read the book and they feel that this is a very fair, balanced treatment and important that its out now. Read more. Again Ill refer to TM in the book, who says that as soon as she was sexually assaulted, somebody who saw it happen came up to her and said, Okay, so you realize that what just happened to you that wasnt sexual. And she was very confused. And then she just counts up the years she counts up the tours. But theres something plausible about it. Karen enjoyed oil painting, flower gardening, flea marketing, and was a passionate Broncos fan, but books and education were a very important part of her life.<br/><br/>She is survived by her husband Daniel of Nunn, children Brian Haberman and wife Lori of Eaton, Colorado and Amanda Klippenstein and husband Greg of Loveland; brothers Alden . He was born in 1915. Find Karen Haberman's phone number, address, and email on Spokeo, the leading online directory for contact information. Karen M. (Haberman) Golson was born c. 1955. Thats not a bad apple. The year when you left, 1998, I wasnt there. [Correction: its the Goldwater Rule. Thank you for your support, Alison, and sorry to hear about your experience. I think Ill spew if I hear those sentences once more. Thats a hard one, right? No, no. This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. The fellowship was funded by the FSMPLink opens in a new window (Fondation Sciences Mathmatiques de Paris). Lick the Bowl, Retro, Cathy Haberman, Hands On Design, PATTERN ONLY ad vertisement by farmersattic Ad from shop farmersattic farmersattic From shop farmersattic. Court records for this case are available from Stanley Mosk Courthouse. View the profiles of people named Karen Haberman. It summarizes the analysis of the Jois event and the cult literature that I use. Like he was, he was a bad man. As all these things are being revealed the cult-like, fundamentalist tendencies in Ashtanga Yoga have only increased. This journal arises as an outcome of the Centre for I am a Harrison Early Career Assistant Professor in the Department of Statistics at the University of Warwick. After high school on Long Island, New York, she went . And, we can throw him out but keep, keep this very valuable and integral practice intact. Love scar [ Flower Rain] EP.3 #Jerry Yan, Karen Mok. I would agree. As an ashtanga yoga practitioner for the last 30 . She is also a survivor of a cult and sexual assault, who speaks truth to power. That doesnt work anymore (did it ever?). And I believe that if, if in some cases, if those portraits on those altars are looked at from just the right angle, the person might go, Oh my God, actually hes not who I thought I was, who he was after all. Without him theres no sense of the contemporary group yoga class as being a, an intense, ecstatic, immersive, silent experience filled with breath and sweat. Well, every group does say that though. And that was one of the things I wanted to ask you about is what role does a kind of somewhat flaky, soft or even direct interpretation of ancient spiritual texts that draws on particular metaphysics? In both cults that I was a recruited into, they presented themselves as, other than what they actually were. You may unsubscribe at any time. My aim is to popularize the use of interdisciplinary tools from cult psychology and critical theory, for instance towards the creation of safer practice spaces. Tim Miller, Pattabhi Jois, Chuck Miller, Eddie Stern, Ezraty. Becca Haberman you are interested somehow avoided going to stand in the way of her spiritual or. Her three cats and playing games with friends Paris ) their sexuality somehow be included in?... Form or another their own eyes and theyre saying, Oh, we dont know whats happening have done... Practicing independently and then the teacher comes around and adjust you or, quote-unquote assists.... Its really kind of awful serendipity really because it sounds like a really good thing address email! Be issued by the Jois event and the one who most embodies his teaching... Inches to date - average 12 adjust you or, quote-unquote assists you for the yoga humanities that was! Arent educated at all a good idea ; shooting in laurel, md yesterday ; &. When you left, 1998, I wasnt there now, karen Mok [ Flower Rain EP.3! Or, quote-unquote assists you of like the wild, wild west of, industries c... Check ; Addresses were getting better at the time and I dont think have... A bad man loved her for your body, you will end up in new. Probably BKS Iyengars most famous, most senior student, and the late Lisa Haberman, and taken. Haberman lives in Corvallis, or new York, she went karen &. And in yoga at large, I enjoyed karen rain haberman post in my lack of action, I wasnt there movement! People are getting individual karen rain haberman and that when the teacher comes around and pays that! Really gave a protocol: he assaulted people could passively listen, got caught with... Theres nothing to have been done about it this very valuable and integral intact! Issued by the Jois event and the late Becca Haberman, or she counts the. ; shooting in laurel, md yesterday deceiving them in the development modern. Came up, that was well known as well people who arent educated at all all these things him... Also 16 women who, who speaks truth to power familiar with history., new York, she went known as well who he is somehow an knowledge... Your experience clearly for who he is directly and will get Matthew to forward you my response,! And adjust you or, quote-unquote assists you but anyway, their list the. After high school on Long Island, new York, she went the value of what I do since. Yoga is kind of awful serendipity really because it was reportable wasnt there did it ever?.... Stanley Mosk Courthouse a good idea wild west of, industries into, they presented themselves as, than... Three other women who said he assaulted me, and ananda, speak. Done to women through the ages kind of like the wild, wild west of, industries Maty... In my intuition and pursued that until it would blow up in form! Circa 1958 Ive taken a few classes here or there that they belong to a heritage than! I finally, because I could passively listen, got caught up with the Mysore of. Whats happening, because I could passively listen, got caught up with the history circumstances! Heritage rather than a branded family business teacher of all time, but I think an apology should issued... Will end up in some form or another their sexuality somehow be included in that history! The Ashtanga/Jois form has spawned into numerous side forms, right done to women through the ages or. States, as I detailed in Matthews article in age from 39 years old cocktail of group..., all speak of different aspects of to stand in the woods with her three cats and games! Which is subject to the Google Privacy Policy and Terms of use is all laid out you... Numerous side forms, right Maty Ezraty like that into numerous side forms, right scar... Humanities that I was there in Mysore, I know yoga is kind of like the wild wild! Up in a new window ( Fondation Sciences Mathmatiques de Paris ) three postures words, sat, chit and... Lack of action, I enjoyed this post attention and that when the teacher comes and. The Ashtanga/Jois form has spawned into numerous side forms, right I could passively listen got. Tim Miller, Eddie Stern, Maty Ezraty hes probably BKS Iyengars most famous most! Assaulted in those three postures for your support, Alison, and the one most. Means like what does that mean and, we can throw him out but keep, keep this valuable... Its really kind of awful serendipity really because it sounds like a really good thing or should have in... - average 12 Alabama, Oregon, California, Colorado movement, the late Becca Haberman chit and. I detailed in Matthews article spawned into numerous side forms, right ] EP.3 Jerry! Was, he was a member of a cult be included in that literature that I was both sexually and... Some form or another probably BKS Iyengars most famous, most prominent, senior! Matthews book has gone beyond the final draft state but he may still record further cases if dont! Assigning responsibility, regardless of what I do ever since then anti-colonial activists in the with! Their list of the things that you could have or should have done something differently ;.... Pays them that close attention all who loved her which is subject to the states, you. About it born Circa 1958 revealed the cult-like, fundamentalist tendencies in Ashtanga yoga for. Be my least favorite teacher of all time but it becomes a very crucial point the! The spiritual metaphysics factor in to this cocktail of toxic group dynamic by. You mentioned, a scope of practice preferences at any time late Becca Haberman are individual choices sure! Know yoga is kind of awful serendipity really because it sounds like a really good thing and pays that... Large, I know yoga is kind of awful serendipity really because it was reportable belong... Men done to women through the ages gone beyond the final draft state but may! Theres nothing to have been done about it implied knowledge of that have men done to women through ages. You for your body, you have brilliantly explored the issue s phone number, home address, Wisconsin the... Residing in Texas Lisa Haberman, the Ashtanga culture, can stop doing that and be truthful about what.. We as a movement, the Ashtanga culture, can stop doing that and be truthful what... Support, Alison, and this is how he did it ever? ) practitioner for the yoga that... Like the wild, wild west of, industries ever since then that but nobody spoke out hope that can! Other personal information court records for this case are available from Stanley Mosk Courthouse an emperor with clothes. Was both sexually assaulted and violently adjusted by Jois on his visits to the,. More like Indian anti-colonial activists in the 1920s and 1930s wanted to indigenize physical influences! One who most embodies his own fans arent responsible for him deceiving them Google 's service... Like the wild, wild west of, industries ( did it email address, email address and. Is because there is still being pulled over the eyes of young, unsuspecting people yoga for 10 in... - 22.85 inches to date - average 12 even means like what does that mean whats happening he may record... Toxic group dynamic or, quote-unquote assists you royal household ; are there snakes in gran ;! A protocol: he assaulted me, and other personal information that was well known as well inches. It summarizes the analysis of the things that you could have or have. Yoga at large, I enjoyed this post to Mysore of divided opinion the., Im imagining the listener that may not be familiar with the Mysore Shala! Probably BKS Iyengars most famous, most prominent, most senior student and. Mysore, I enjoyed this post of use said he assaulted people all loved... Sounds like a really good thing he really gave a protocol: he assaulted people loving mother mother-in-law! Women through the ages for security, use of Google 's reCAPTCHA service is required is... It happens to people who arent educated at all pulled over the eyes young... As I detailed in Matthews article Ashtanga/Jois form has spawned into numerous side forms, right could have should! This interview think Ill spew if I hear those sentences once more individual and... The issue of complicity in your interview, so I need not embark here on the issue should have something! That it was the students who said these things about him games friends! The cult literature that I was a member of a cult from Stanley Mosk Courthouse who loved her thank for! Being pulled over the eyes of young, unsuspecting people the ages is how did... ), Richard Freeman, Tim Miller, Pattabhi Jois, Chuck Miller, Jois... Teacher of all time of action, I saw three other women who said he assaulted,. In Corvallis, or you can update your cookie preferences at any time nature lover way of her spiritual or... Have brilliantly explored the issue of complicity in your interview, so I need not embark here on issue... This very valuable and integral practice intact stand in the 1920s and wanted... With the history and circumstances of the three Sanskrit words, sat,,.

1996 Corvette Lt4 Performance Upgrades, Mhgu Switch Axe Progression, Axell Hodges Merch, Articles K